Mrs. Moritz's 9th Honors English

Wednesday, October 11, 2006

Firemen

Hi everyone. Do me a favor... read your peers blogs so that I don't have to read a bunch of redundant information. React to what your classmates say. Try to interact with each other through this blog. Here we go...

1. Describe the role of firemen today; how are they generally received by the public?

2. How did 9/11 affect our perceptions of firemen?

3. How are firemen perceived by the public in Fahrenheit 451? (page 7) Why do you think this is?

posted by mmoritz at 10/11/2006 10:35:00 AM

34 Comments:

  • Question 1:
    Firemen are received by the publc as heros. They run into burning buildings to save others they don't even know. They care for everyone and want to get everyone to safety even if it means that they give their lives like in 9/11. Thay probaly didn't even give it a second thought about running into the trade centers over and over tring to save as many lives as they can.

    By Blogger Damian L., at 1:28 PM  

  • Question #1-
    Today firefighters are seen as heros, not only because they have to put out fires, but because they save lives and homes. Because of 9/11 they recieve a different level of respect, higher than they recieved before. People percieve them as full of courage, where as before, they were seen as average and it was just cool to know peers with that profession. Fire Fighters went from being impressive to being outstanding.

    By Blogger Liz, at 2:04 PM  

  • I agree with Damian L. In our world today, firemen are perceived as heroes. Because they are! They do whatever they have to in order to save other people, which sometimes means not being able to save themselves. As Annika said, since 9/11, people have began appreciating firemen more than ever before. We now know that they risk their lives each and every day. Most people wouldn't do that. 9/11 also showed how we, as Americans will stand together when we are led by great people. Although I wasn't there, I'm sure that people in the Towers knew that some people were trying to save them. Because of this, they could have stuck together and helped each other get to the safest place they could find, so that it would be easier for the firemen to save a group of people, instead of just one at a time.

    In Fahrenheit 451, firemen are perceived as somewhat scary people. I think this is because people know that they have a large amount of power, although not in a good way. People don't really know that firemen used to save people, and put fires out (although Clarise mentioned it), and so they could also think that they are somewhat mean. It seems like the public is just intimidated by firemen.

    <3

    By Blogger .hardcore.love., at 2:09 PM  

  • YES! I totally agree w/ annika and everybody else that mentioned 9/11 firefighters (and i guess all firefighters in general) as heroes. When i was little i always thought about "Mr.Fireman" as being the cool guy who drove the big red truck down the street and fought flames. The first words that came to mind then were "Helpful Community Members" or just 'the good guys.'Now, especially since 9/11, the first thing that comes to mind when I hear the word "firefighter" is hero. I wish I could also add something insightful but y'all stated it all really well.

    By Blogger AlisonB, at 2:18 PM  

  • Just a question for everyone: seeing as this book takes place in 2053, after 9/11, do you think it is realistic that firemen would turn into the "bad guys," or would they stay heroes in the eyes of the public becasue of what they did on 9/11?

    By Blogger matt f., at 2:55 PM  

  • Question 3

    Firemen in this book are percived as scary and horrible people. They make unnecessary fires and burn books. I just found it weird that when Clarisse told him about what the job of a fireman used to be, he didn't know that they used to stop fires instead of starting them. Do you think that Clarisse is one of the only people who knows about what used to happen in the world?

    And one more question,its kind of random though. I might have not heard it but what was the fireman talking about when he said that there was something that lay hidden in the grille?

    By Blogger haleycc, at 3:45 PM  

  • When Matt F. points out that Fahrenheit 451 takes place in 2053, I agree that our view of firefighters may change by then. Although I have always respected people who risk their lives to save others and find them even more heroic after 9/11, I do see how we could forget about all of this honor after 50 more years. I doubt that by then the firefighters will be starting fires instead putting them out, but the public's remembrance of their bravery at 9/11 will fade with time. For our generation and the people alive at the time, our opinions probably won't change as much, but later generations won't feel the personal connection with 9/11 that we will always feel. Think about it this way: for our descendants, 9/11 will be like Pearl Harbor is to us. We care about it and understand its effect on history, but we weren't there so we're not as likely to care and dwell on it.

    By Blogger Rachel K, at 4:40 PM  

  • Question 3
    In Fahrenheit 451, the Firemen are perceived as normal laborers who do a job that is not heroic or exciting, just something that has to be done. This is because Firemen Don't have the heroic job of putting out fires and rescuing people. They just uphold the law by burning contriband. It just something that must be done. like collecting the garbage, or working in a factory.

    By Blogger Barry Tischler, at 4:48 PM  

  • Hello again, mah dears! Well, I like this post! Here we go...

    I think the roles of firefighters today have been pretty well-stated already by my friends here: they are heros. I don't know if any of you have younger siblings, but if you do, perhaps you have heard of the show Higglytown Heros on Disney Channel? It's a really cute little animated show about the heros of this town; everyone from a baker to a plumber to a firefighter is a Higglytown Hero! I mention this show because I think all people are "heros" in their own way to different people, and the perception of heros changes through time. America's symbol of a hero in the earlier years was a cowboy, then Superman. Nowadays, our icon has become the fireman. It is a powerful picture, one must admit: a soot-stained man or woman striding through the rubble of a fallen building, sacrificing his life to save others. That's their job. Isn't that crazy? A firefighters JOB is to die for us. Any of us, all of us. It doesn't matter what kind of car you drive, or how much money you make, or how nice your shirt looks to a firefighter: they save EVERYONE. A powerful thought, really. There's some religious parallels here that I won't get into (I don't want to offend anyone) but it is certainly interesting to think about.

    9/11 is perhaps the biggest event in American history after the Revolutionary War because, like the Revolution, it defines Americans as people. We are the country that, in times of terrible hardship and destruction, come together to overcome whatever is facing us. 9/11 brought heros to our eyes again, everyday people like firemen who work so hard to save lives. That is why the fireman is such an Amercian symbol. It shows how strong and united we as a nation can be when it really matters, when it's truely important.

    People in Fahrenheit 451 are afraid of firemen, according to page 7. I think that this is a logical fear, but different in our time. In today's world, little kids are often afraid of firemen because of the outfits they have to wear to protect themselves. The mask, the coat, the boots...all together through smoke it can be a terrifying combination. And then there's always the doubt that no one talks about: what if the fireman doesn't save me? What if, when we're in the midst of the smoke and the flames and the house is falling down around our ears, what if he or she chooses to turn away and let me die? And am I even worth saving? In the time of Fahrenheit 451, firemen are regarded with fear because they bring out our fear now: they DO NOT save the people. They burn books, burn what is precious and rare and forbidden, tear apart lives and homes and send people to insane asylums. (Oooo, vocabulary word!)They bring out that root fear, so thereby become terrifying people.

    To haleycc, my buddy! I think that Clarisse is one of the only ones that knows about the past, but I'm not sure why. (A stolen book, perhaps?) And I suspect that the thing behind the grate is a book that Montag stole, although I of course don't know for sure. To mattf: that is such an insightful comment! How cool! You are brilliant. That's a great thing to think about...

    Wow, sorry my blog is so long, pals! Stay safe, have a nice night! ~me.

    By Blogger CMeghan, at 4:50 PM  

  • I know we're not supposed to be repeating information, so I'm going to try my best. Even as I'm writing this, I'm still not positive as to which question I'm resoinding to. I completely agree with everyone about the hero aspect. Our society has this wonderful outlook on firefighters, and rightfully so. But I think Matt brought up an excellent point. This book was written pre-9/11. We've all been saying how 9/11 changed our appreciation, or perspective of firefighters. Do you think it's possible that the reverse has occured in the book? Is it possible that some major event changed society's view of these once heros? When a tradegy occurs, humans are excellent at the blame game. Could the firefighters have been the victims of an event like that?

    By Blogger Martha P., at 5:12 PM  

  • In response to question #2
    So far I agree with everyone, and especially with the people who imagined firefighters as guys in trucks as a little kid. I too was one of those people, but I did not see them as men in trucks, I didnt even realize that. I thought all firemen were just guys that came to school and made your teacher put on a little yellow uniform that was huge on them. As the years went on I realized that I was wrong but until 9/11 I never really knew that they were that dedicated to saving lives. It completely changed my opinion of them and now I think they are courageous, and strong, and everything that everyone else said so far.

    By Blogger Natalie Jones, at 5:21 PM  

  • I agree with everyone else who has responded to question two. If you asked a little kid who they think a hero is they would probably say Superman, Spiderman, Batman, etc. After 9/11 people saw (including kids) that the firefighters act just like the heroes in comic books. They save the day and peoples' lives by facing dangerous situations just like superheroes. However, they are humans and can be killed unlike most superheroes who have special powers to help them stay alive. Firefighters have one major super power which is courage. I think many people realized that after 9/11. When they died trying to save others' lives people really saw them as heroes becasue they saw them as people they could count on to save the day and their lives. So now if you were to ask a little kid (or anybody)who they think a hero was and a lot of them would say firefighters.

    By Blogger kayla f, at 5:54 PM  

  • Tim has a very good point. Actually, every post I have read has a good point, I just would like to point out Tim's again because I think that one really stands out. I hadn't thought that the significance of firemen in Farenheit 451 is the same as today's firemen, only different purposes, but that makes so much sense. I also think that both kinds of firemen are respected, it is just extremely different kinds of respect. The firemen in the book are respected out of fear, and because they have the power to burn your house. The firemen in the real world are respected because they are viewed as heroes for saving lives and risking their own.

    Note: firefighteres have always been viewed as heroes, it is just that it takes something like 9/11 to really show and remind the world how heroic they are, so 9/11 didn't so much change people's views of firefighters as renewed them.

    By Blogger Tina L, at 5:55 PM  

  • Question 1

    I agree with damian and the others that firemen play the role of heroes in our society. I also like what natalie said that, 9/11 really showed what firemen were really doing. They are role-models and heroes to children. Then I think of them now as silent, selfless, heros, doing their duty without question. I know there are exceptions. I think it takes a large tragic event for the majority to realize what they do at take it for its full value. I also fing it amazing that they can be so selfless simply in the name that they are doing their duty, or doing what is right. I think it would be hard to put others lives beofre your own the way they do on a daily basis.

    By Blogger Tony J., at 5:57 PM  

  • Question 2
    Barry is the only one who has brought up the oppinion that firemen aren't percieved as bad guys. I was trying to say that before he posted his, however the site is being stupid and won't accept my password. On page 7, Clarisse says,"So many people are. Afraid of firemen.", but she never says anything about them being percieved as bad guys. I never got the opinion that anyone, other than the people who owned books, found the firemen as infamous or anything. In sixth hour today, we were talking about a person who a few people in class were afraid of. Then someone vouched for that person saying that he was a really nice person when you got to know him. It is the same way with the firemen, people are afraid of them, because they have probably never met or talked to one.

    By Blogger kyle, at 5:57 PM  

  • Wow, this blog has certainly spiced up a bit! Every single one of you guys has something fabulous to say!

    To Matt: That is an excelent point! I never really thought of that... Society does really strange things to people. I mean, if 9/11 hadn't happen, do you think we would view fire fighters in the same way, whether it be now or in the future? Was the admiration of the heroes of 9/11 really a general admiration or was it just a folling of the crowd to soon be forgotten for other "more important" people. (ie: political figures, movies stars etc.)?

    To Meg: Higglytown heroes! YES! I think it's really interesting that you bring that up. Because what happens when kids see that show? They say, "Mommy! Guess what? I want to be a _____ when I grow up!" Whatever that might be, the kids ADMIRE the people who are symbolized on the show.

    I wonder if Bradbury DELIBERATELY chose the role of a fire fighter (one of the most dangerous, heroic, neccessary jobs in the world) to something to be feared and regarded with horror. Maybe he was attempting to predict the future... or maybe he was just trying to sound a wake up call. Maybe he what he was trying to say through his similies and metaphors and descriptive language was: "YO! PEOPLE! Look around you! There are heroes in your midst who sacrifice their lives every day and you don't even recognize it! What would you do if they suddenly became "evil" and started destroying something that you loved most?"

    Just some food for thought... haha. Food for thought! Sorry Cornil's history joke. I am so terrible. :)

    Peace,
    Rachel

    By Blogger RachelP, at 6:59 PM  

  • Question 1, I'm thinking.

    Just like Martha, I think it'd be hard not to repeat what everyone else said since we all have the same views. I think we are taught as little kids that firefighters are heroes, and that they risk their lives to save ours. I certainly think they are regarded with very high respect, even to the point that they get to run redlights. :] But without them, we would have many more injuries and property losses. So their benefits are very great to us, and I don't think people can think of a reason we shouldn't have them (especially since no one else wants to risk their lives at their jobs).

    Fireman are like the big heroic teddybears of life. As little kids we're told how friendly and safe we are with them, and then as we grow up we realize their huge signifigance in our society.


    --Kylie

    By Blogger KylieYoum, at 7:09 PM  

  • In answer to Matt F. 's question, I think that 9/11 will fade into history just like Chernobyl. I am sure that if you asked 10 kids in our class about Chernobyl, only a few would be able to answer with decent details to support the idea that they understood what they were talking about. Even though that is a very legendary and tragic event that effected many generations to come, it, like many other "major" historical events, has faded into history and been replaced by modern (or more modern) day news.
    On another note, I completely agree with annika and everyone else about how 9/11 changed the point of view of many people on the topic of Firemen. I digress.
    *CONECTION*
    In 1984 (which me and many others in our class had to read for mrs. p in 7th grade) the job of the main character is to rewrite history so that it goes with all the political stances of the country's leader. For example: If they were at war with Eastaisa, they had ALWAYS been at war with Eastaisa, and when an alliance was formed between Oceana (sp) and Eastaisa, they had ALWAYS been in alliance with Eastaisa. The history was erased so that the people would have no say or coment about conflict with the country's leader's decisions. In F451, history has been erased so that what the political leader says is right, is right. And life has always been that way without ANY conflicting openions on decisions.
    Question to throw out:
    What is they symbolism of the books on the front cover of all of our school copy books? Is that fact that they are all written by renouned writers symbolic? Is anything else about their physical being symbolic?
    Sorry if I wrote too much...

    :P It is not life that is bad, but the way you percieve it.

    By Blogger Emma Grace, at 7:34 PM  

  • hahahahaha this doesnt have anything to do with the blogggg.
    but alright goodriddance!
    i love how you put in part of our class conversation on here.
    you are awesome.

    and sry if i got a lil fired up during that.
    especially mrs. mortiz.
    im srry if you thought i was attacking you.
    that wasn't my point and i didn't mean anything by it.

    By Blogger .hardcore.love., at 7:41 PM  

  • I completely agree with hardcore<3! I think everyone agrees that after 9/11 firemen and police men weren't just poeple who were at the other end of a 911 phone call. We were really young when the 9/11 attacks happened, so I think we were really unaware of how important these people really were. Then after 9/11 I think we began to understand that firemen were peole who could save our lives and were willing to risk their lifes to do that!

    By Blogger SarahE2010, at 8:00 PM  

  • Bwhahahaha! it's me. again. teehee. Well, I just wanted to say a few quick things as I'm taking a break from studying biology.

    To Rachel, partner in crime: food for thought, hahahaha! that really was in BAD TASTE!!!! ;)

    To katieorlandini, my bud: do you really think Montag doesn't love his wife? Anyone have opinions on this? Because I, personally, think he loves her very much. But I think the trouble is that he's confused the real Mildred with his idea of her. Throughout life, it becomes heartbreakingly clear that not everyone can be the way you want them to. Perhaps even worse: not everyone can be what you NEED them to be. I think if he just leaned over and kissed her, brought some life back into her frozen body and warmth into her mouth which can only spew cold nonesense...maybe things would be okay. Maybe they could pick up the pieces.

    Okay, I PROMISE I won't write anymore tonight! x and o to everyone. ~me.

    By Blogger CMeghan, at 8:44 PM  

  • Hnnnnng okay I just typed up THE LONGEST POST. EVER. And then I logged in and the post was lost. So here we go again.

    Okay! I agree with almost everyone that has posted in that firemen are now, and have always been, perceived as heroes. Rightfully so. They risk their lives so others might live. Their job description also includes enduring extreme conditions- and extreme conditions are something that we, as Americans, are kind of obsessed with (hello, reality television). Speaking of America, firefighting is sort of an all-American career choice. Its rumored glory infiltrates even our youngest generations (surely you've met a kid whose sole dream is to fight fires! It's the ultimate combination of power and bravery).

    But with regards to question two, I think that the prestige and honor of being a firefighter has skyrocketed since 9/11. It's one thing to know that firefighters will keep your neighbor's house-fire from spreading to your front lawn. It's something else entirely to know that firefighters will pull injured Americans from the site of a disaster, will help to physically combat the after-effects of an act of terror. Suddenly, firefighters are no longer just brave and strong- they're freedom fighters.

    One last note- it's interesting how, in modern society, we simultaneously (and unrelatedly) see firefighters as heroes and see information as power. In the bookverse world of Fahrenheit 451, firefighters are viewed as seedy and perhaps power-hungry, and are in charge of destroying information (in book form, anyway). I don't know how the two are related; I'm just mentioning it.

    That post was nowhere NEAR as long as my other one. YOU'RE WELCOME.
    :) Goodnight everybody.

    By Blogger laura h., at 9:13 PM  

  • I think that not only 9/11 changed our opinion but also the movies and media that has been made regarding firemen. I think that firemen were much like soldiers. Everyone know and respects their courage and bravery howeverno one knows about them and no one really cares, and this is a shame. WIth movies on 9/11 and for example ladder 49 forefighters are regarded highly.

    By Blogger Dan E, at 9:40 PM  

  • this is just a test post to see if my account is working okay. everyone can ignore this! thanks. ~me

    By Blogger CMeghan, at 8:16 AM  

  • I interpret he quote that emily provided ("You know, I'm not afraid of you at all." Montag responds with, "Why should you be?")a little differently. I think tht Montag is trying to say that he realises that he is feared, but he knows that he is just a normal person and is trying to express this to Clarisse.

    By Blogger matt f., at 12:03 PM  

  • Response to question 1:
    Today, the role of fireman is to be service men for the public. They often risk their very lives to save people caught in fires. They do all that they can to put out the fires that are consuming a house or building. They are always recieved well because they are servants to us. People normally don't hate or not like those that truly serve them, like firemen. They are seen as modern day heros. Little kids look up to them as they would their dad, like a hero, and want to be like them. The role of a fireman is very looked up to and a noble profession.

    By Blogger Chelsea, at 12:09 PM  

  • hey y'all!!! does anyone else realize that we have no new post to respond to? this isn't necessarily bad...it's just odd. ah well, I'll respond to some of my pals!

    To Matt: I am with you a 110%, mah friend. I also interpreted the quote of Montag ("Why should you be?") as the character trying to put Clarisse at ease. I don't think he wants her to fear him...I actaully suspect there might be a little love in his heart towards her. Clarisse awakens things in Montag he thought he'd forgotten: hope and values and truth and the past.

    Speaking of the past, have any of you ever heard the quote "whoever controls the past controls the future?" It's from 1984, the drama AHS is putting on November 2, 3, and 4th at 7pm all nights! You should all come: tickets are only $5 and it's a really amazing show that pertains to the theme of Fahrenheit 451!! Okay, now that I've had my moment to sell our show, back to the past. In 1984, the government literally CHANGES the past; they hire people to change histroy by editing out people, events...anything they don't want the people to know. They are watched constantly by telescreens, a lot like the t.v. walls in F 451. I personally believe that Bradbury was influenced by George Orwell's 1984 because of all the similarities there are. People are confused, people are all the same, people aren't aloud to think...there are so many parallels it's outstanding! if you're having a little trouble with the book, COME SEE 1984! it definitally helps one understand what's going on, from a different perspective!

    By Blogger CMeghan, at 4:11 PM  

  • To Meg: Cheers for 1984! "2+2=4! 2+2=4!" YAY FOR EXTRAS!! "Criminal!!"

    Ok. I am officially done... Yah, Katie, I have no idea what we were supposed to blog about... I think there would have been a question posted... at least I hope so.

    By Blogger RachelP, at 5:35 PM  

  • To Rachel: war is peace. freedom is slavery. ignorance is strentgh! DO IT TO JULIA! hahahahahahahahahaha. seriously people, you have to come to 1984! you'll love it, and you'll get to see rachel and in action!

    To katie: no idea at all!

    To Shane: this is a great simile with the professional athletes! i like the way you think. this goes back to everyone being heros, etc.

    A question for you all, pals: who is your hero and why?

    x and o ~me.

    By Blogger CMeghan, at 6:07 PM  

  • hey, so im not sure if we are supposed to blog but...

    I totally agree with you hmadsen. I also feel like the firefighters, or at least Guy, seem to be sheltered from the way the public veiws them. I think that the public veiws the men as dangerous and cruel. But I don't feel that Guy really fits that description, do you? But I have a question: what do you think happened to the police, because the book said that they usually come and pick up the person who has the books, but in last nights case, they didn't. What do you think happened to them that made them neglect to come pick up the woman?

    By Blogger haleycc, at 6:26 PM  

  • To address kristen, I think that if the government really tried, and I mean really, then history could be changed. I mean first they would just not teach kids the real history and replace it with all of the fake stuff. It is possible but my question is why would the government want to change history? what good does this do for them?

    To address katie,
    I think its just a coinsidence that we are reading this book at the same time as 1984

    By Blogger Natalie Jones, at 7:04 PM  

  • #3 Many people in the book are afraid of firemen and think of them as the evil vilains in the society. People think this because they break into peoples' houses and burn their books often aresting or harming ther person in posetion of the books. I found this irony to be rather hilarius as the firemen of the future are the total opposite of the firemen of the present down to every fiber of their existence including their jobs and the peols thoughts of them.

    By Blogger Laine G, at 7:19 PM  

  • I thought there was supposed to be another blog up today, but maybe I'm wrong.

    So to respond to what Meghan had said...

    I have quite a few heroes. And whenever people ask why they are my heroes, I have to go off on a tangent of explaining why. FIrst, are my three swim coaches, because of all the work they put into making me better and because of all the experience they have in the business that I can learn from. And they never stop teaching, either. Which makes them heroic to me because they are helping me in life in ways that they don't even know.

    Next are two of my friends on my swim team, Johnny and Jeff, who are always there for me when the going gets tough. They push me to swim faster and be a better person. And they encourage me to keep going when I feel like I can't at all.


    Those are just to name a couple, and I think being a hero has to do with more than just saving lives, but helping you during your life, to make you your best. That's heroic-nism to me.

    :]

    By Blogger KylieYoum, at 7:50 PM  

  • First off, you all are making great points that I would have never thought of. Like Martha I really don't know which question I'm responding to. I do have a question however about this book. What could have happened to our world to end up like the world in this book? Because it would have to be a pretty drastic change to have firefighters to make fires rather than putting them out. To answer a question I think that our views before 9/11 of firefighters is that we were scared of them just for thereasons people have said before hand. After 9/11 we saw them more as heroes as I said in my first blog. Sorry if I repeated a little bit because I did my best.

    By Blogger kayla f, at 9:53 PM  

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